The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

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Article promoted by Ian Rose (talk) via MilHistBot (talk) 14:06, 2 April 2015 (UTC) « Return to A-Class review list[reply]

Nominator(s): MisterBee1966 (talk)

Hermann Graf (edit | talk | history | links | watch | logs)

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Yet another German World War II fighter pilot I am nominating this article for A-Class. I believe to have covered all major aspects of his career and life. Please let me know what you think about the article. Thanks! MisterBee1966 (talk) 07:19, 23 January 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Comments (pending support) by Auntieruth

• Very interesting article. It had some grammatical and wording issues, which I've tweaked. Feel free to revert if I've changed meaning. I've also smoothed out some duplication.

• Thanks MisterBee1966 (talk) 08:59, 9 February 2015 (UTC)[reply]

• Okay, so how did he end up in American hands? Schuman says one thing, but one of the external links you provide as additional information says something else.

• Can you help me out here? What aspect exactly is different? He surrendered to the Americans, they handed him over to the Soviets. Is that not clear? MisterBee1966 (talk) 14:56, 9 February 2015 (UTC)[reply]

• Sources you've cited look reliable and credible. Thought you might find this interesting as well. Endler and Pele in Der Spiegel. " Die Pelés flogen unter dem Namen "Dr. Graf und Frau" mit einer Lufthansa-Boeing-707 nach Frankfurt. "

• Thanks, I had a look at the Spiegel article, I am unsure if it is safe to conclude that Dr. Graf actually refers to Hermann Graf. MisterBee1966 (talk) 08:59, 9 February 2015 (UTC)[reply]

• I know you're out of town visiting your mom, so when you get back, .... auntieruth (talk) 21:18, 3 February 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Support Comments

• Why is the bit on him helping Jews escape to Switzerland piped to German Resistance to Nazism? Unless I'm missing something, this happened before the Nazis' rise to power.

• removed link MisterBee1966 (talk) 14:47, 9 February 2015 (UTC)[reply]

• "over over Kharkov" - also, piping that to the First Battle of Kharkov article seems a bit WP:EGGy to me. I'd suggest rewording to "Flying air superiority missions during the First Battle of Kharkov in September..."

• done MisterBee1966 (talk) 08:59, 9 February 2015 (UTC)[reply]

• "On 30 April 1942 he became an "ace-in-a-day" after shooting down six enemy aircraft in the region followed by seven on 2 May and 8 May respectively." - this mentions 3 days but only 2 kill tallies - were the 7 kills split between 2 and 8 May?

• reworded, seven on 2 May and again seven on 8 May MisterBee1966 (talk) 09:03, 9 February 2015 (UTC)[reply]

• "When he claimed his 150th victory, a Yakovlev Yak-1, on 4 September 1942, his own aircraft suffered over 100 hits during this encounter. He was the second pilot, after Gordon Gollob, to achieve this mark." - this makes it sound like Gollob's claim to fame was having more than 100 hits to his aircraft. It would make more sense to rework these sentences to something like "On 4 September 1942, he claimed his 150th victory, a Yakovlev Yak-1; he was the second pilot, after Gordon Gollob, to achieve this mark. Graf's aircraft suffered over 100 hits during the engagement with the Yak-1."

• reworded. MisterBee1966 (talk) 12:02, 10 February 2015 (UTC)[reply]

• "...married the German actress Jola Jobst..." - she has already been introduced, just her last name will do at this point.

• done MisterBee1966 (talk) 08:59, 9 February 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Excellent work as usual. Parsecboy (talk) 18:56, 6 February 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Images

• File:Hermann_Graf.jpg: strongly suggest using ((non-free biog-pic)) instead of the current tag, and expanding the FUR accordingly. Nikkimaria (talk) 16:39, 7 February 2015 (UTC)[reply]

• done MisterBee1966 (talk) 09:23, 9 February 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Comments

• No DABs, external links OK. More later.--Sturmvogel 66 (talk) 19:41, 4 March 2015 (UTC)[reply]

• CommentsSupport
  • No dab links (no action req'd).
  • No issues with external links (no action req'd).
  • Images all have alt text (no action req'd).
  • No duplicate links (no action req'd).
  • Images check completed above (one point outstanding it seems).
  • Captions look fine (no action req'd).
  • The Citation Check Tool reveals no issues with ref consolidation (no action req'd).
  • "In the late spring, 1941 Graf claimed his first aerial victory on 4 August 1941 during Operation Barbarossa" - seems redundant to say "1941" twice in this phrase.
    • reworded MisterBee1966 (talk) 19:10, 18 March 2015 (UTC)[reply]
  • These two stubby sentences could be linked: "Inflation in the Weimar Republic in 1923 wiped out all the family savings. From a very early age, Hermann learned to work hard to make a living." Consider instead: "Inflation in the Weimar Republic in 1923 wiped out all the family savings and, as a result, from a very early age, Hermann learned to work hard to make a living." (suggestion only)
    • done MisterBee1966 (talk) 19:38, 18 March 2015 (UTC)[reply]
  • Incorrect tense here I think: "Here the trio of Füllgrabe, Graf and Grislawski is joined by..." should be "Here the trio of Füllgrabe, Graf and Grislawski was joined by..."
    • done MisterBee1966 (talk) 19:36, 18 March 2015 (UTC)[reply]
  • "In early June the unit transferred back to Romania..." incorrect link to Romania here (it should have been linked at first instance, if at all).
    • done MisterBee1966 (talk) 19:32, 18 March 2015 (UTC)[reply]
  • "On 3 February 1942 he accounted for his victim number 47..." → "On 3 February 1942 he accounted for his 47th victim..."
    • done MisterBee1966 (talk) 19:32, 18 March 2015 (UTC)[reply]
  • "Upon his return to his post...", consider wording more simply as "Upon return to his post..."
    • done MisterBee1966 (talk) 19:32, 18 March 2015 (UTC)[reply]
  • Long run-on sentence here: "The next day, Graf, officially remaining in command of JG 50, was appointed acting Geschwaderkommodore of JG 1 and transferred to Jever and Graf appointed Grislawski as acting-commander of JG 50." → consider instead something like: "The next day, Graf, officially remaining in command of JG 50, was appointed acting Geschwaderkommodore of JG 1 and transferred to Jever. Graf subsequently appointed Grislawski as acting-commander of JG 50."
    • done MisterBee1966 (talk) 19:41, 18 March 2015 (UTC)[reply]
  • "This relatively early release was by many perceived to be caused..." → " This relatively early release was perceived by many to be caused..."
    • done MisterBee1966 (talk) 19:36, 18 March 2015 (UTC)[reply]
  • Graf's release from captivity as a PW is mentioned in both the "prisoner of war" section and the "later life" section (including the date), which seems a little unnecessary. Suggest moving the detail re his release from the "later life section" to the "prisoner of war" section and deleting any duplication.
    • restructured MisterBee1966 (talk) 20:01, 18 March 2015 (UTC)[reply]
  • In the table of aerial victories there seems to be a typo for the date of victory # 48. Currently listed as being in 1943, but I assume from the other entries it should be 1942. Anotherclown (talk) 06:14, 18 March 2015 (UTC)[reply]
    • done good spot MisterBee1966 (talk) 19:10, 18 March 2015 (UTC)[reply]
      • Thanks for the review, I believe to have addressed your comments. MisterBee1966 (talk) 20:01, 18 March 2015 (UTC)[reply]
        • Not worries. Those changes look fine, added my support now. Anotherclown (talk) 12:32, 19 March 2015 (UTC)[reply]

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The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.