The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was Draftify‎. (non-admin closure) Let'srun (talk) 19:54, 21 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Matias Fernandez-Pardo

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Association football player who does not satisfy general notability, and does not satisfy football notability criteria because those redirect to basic sports notability which redirects to general notability. This is a contested draftification. There are three references. The first of them is a database entry which shows that he plays association football. The second and third are articles in Dutch, which, on machine translation, are about the team, and not about him.

Table replaced below. Robert McClenon (talk) 19:17, 14 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Reference Number	Reference	Comments	Independent	Significant	Reliable	Secondary
1	Soccerway	A database entry	Yes	No	Yes	No
2	https://www.nieuwsblad.be/sportwereld/live/voetbal/347570	In Dutch. On machine translation, about the team.	Yes	No	Yes	Yes
3	onefootball.com/en/news/duitse-landskampioen-komt-speler-ophalen-bij-kaa-gent-39623474	This article, on translation, is not about the player but about the team	Yes	No	Yes	Yes

Draftify as nominator. There may be significant coverage in the future. Robert McClenon (talk) 16:16, 14 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Note: This discussion has been included in the deletion sorting lists for the following topics: Sportspeople, Football, and Belgium. Robert McClenon (talk) 16:16, 14 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Comment This is manipulation on your part. The third source mentions the player by name that he is the focus of attention of the Bundesliga champion! Then this is laziness on your part as well, and you know that he plays in the Belgian Pro League, which is a professional league. Meaning that the article can be expanded and easily achieves notability. --EpicAdventurer (talk) 16:23, 14 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
- Question - Where in the 2024 guidelines is there a guideline about presumed notability based on playing in a professional league? Robert McClenon (talk) 18:21, 14 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
  He scored 8 goals for God's sake in the 8th best European league!!! EpicAdventurer (talk) 20:30, 14 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
  EpicAdventurer: There needs to be WP:SIGCOV. Goals and appearances, unless in specific situations of WP:BIAS, don't count toward WP:GNG. Anwegmann (talk) 20:58, 14 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
  Are you speaking honestly? What makes football players gain fame and value if not goals and appearances? EpicAdventurer (talk) 21:21, 14 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
  @EpicAdventurer: Yes, I am, and so is everyone else. Significant coverage in reliable media sources (again, defined at WP:SIGCOV) adds fame and value, as it were, to a footballer's notability. I admit that it's surprising, but this player lacks that significant coverage. I know this is frustrating to you, but it's the only way to make sure that Wikipedia isn't filled with random articles of footballers who lack notability enough to receive full coverage. Anwegmann (talk) 23:16, 14 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
  You contradict yourself and make readers laugh at these illogical responses. The player plays in the 8th highest-ranked league in UEFA and is active in the Belgian U-19 national team. In addition, I found many sources that directly refer to him. EpicAdventurer (talk) 23:22, 14 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
  @EpicAdventurer: Watch out for WP:PA, please. Anwegmann (talk) 23:44, 14 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

- 8 goals in 16 Belgian Pro League appearances is very impressive. Wikipedia's notability policy requires WP:SIGCOV, EpicAdventurer. You'd expect lots of good newspaper coverage for such a player. But so far, there doesn't seem to be any. Robby.is.on (talk) 21:46, 14 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Draftify – As WP:ATD. Svartner (talk) 17:23, 14 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Comment - There are passing mentions of the subject in sources 2 and 3. I am correcting the source analysis.

Reference Number	Reference	Comments	Independent	Significant	Reliable	Secondary
1	Soccerway	A database entry	Yes	No	Yes	No
2	https://www.nieuwsblad.be/sportwereld/live/voetbal/347570	In Dutch. On machine translation, about the team. Passing mention of player.	Yes	No (passing mention)	Yes	Yes
3	onefootball.com/en/news/duitse-landskampioen-komt-speler-ophalen-bij-kaa-gent-39623474	This article, on translation, is not about the player but about the team. Passing mention of player.	Yes	No	Yes	Yes

Robert McClenon (talk) 18:31, 14 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This discussion has been included in WikiProject Football's list of association football-related deletions. Spiderone^{(Talk to Spider)} 18:41, 14 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Drafify - not currently notable, but might be in future. Giant Snowman 18:46, 14 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I'm fed up with this "encyclopedia". It has turned into a authoritarian community not a cooperative one. EpicAdventurer (talk) 18:48, 14 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Find some good, detailed sources and we will reconsider. Giant Snowman 18:52, 14 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

It seems that the player tends to earn enough WP:GNG in the 2024/25 season, I see good faith in its creation and imagine that the article will not be deleted, making it draft will allow more sources to be added. Svartner (talk) 19:57, 14 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

It's not really about opinion, even though I understand that decisions on AfDs can be very frustrating at times. It's about whether or not there are valid sources enough to fulfill Wikipedia standards. I understand how you feel, to a degree, but you should not give up on this project. Anwegmann (talk) 20:07, 14 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

EpicAdventurer, I think policies and rules established by a community of editors that apply to every article and editor are the opposite of authoritarianism? Robby.is.on (talk) 21:46, 14 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Now what do you want? Have you seen the state of the article or are we only seeing what we want? EpicAdventurer (talk) 21:53, 14 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

The article's okay. But we need WP:SIGCOV to satisfy Wikipedia's notability requirements. Robby.is.on (talk) 22:02, 14 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
This is incapacitating and a trivialization of the editors' efforts, and nothing good will come of it. How many sources should I get for you? EpicAdventurer (talk) 22:07, 14 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

WP:THREE, sources ideally Spiderone^{(Talk to Spider)} 22:40, 14 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

I pity the miserable state of Wikipedia EpicAdventurer (talk) 22:46, 14 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Draftify—I'm tempted to vote keep, as he has performed at the first team level regularly enough to justify it, but I think draftifying is the best option, as this comes across as WP:TOOSOON. Anwegmann (talk) 20:05, 14 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
I was surprised how little coverage there was about a player like this... Giant Snowman 20:58, 14 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Same, honestly. Anwegmann (talk) 23:12, 14 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Can you respond to the replies and evaluate the article based on its current status? How do you rate? Do you understand what you are doing? EpicAdventurer (talk) 23:15, 14 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Draftify If this is the best sourcing available on this footballer, then the subject fails GNG for the time being. Footballers do not get a free pass for playing in a specific league. JTtheOG (talk) 02:42, 15 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Comment. There is some promising stuff, not surprising for a player who has made his breakthrough in a relatively big team and league. Unfortunately, all Belgian (reliable) media are paywalled. These look like profiles, albeit written by the same person: [1] [2]. These looks like assessments of skill based on particular games (not match reports): [3] [4] Can we get some more eyes on these, maybe some who can break through the paywall? Geschichte (talk) 19:46, 15 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
The first is an interview with little secondary info, and what's there is just summarizing what he's quoted saying: Until last weekend, Matias Fernandez-Pardo only kicked off an official match once for the Buffaloes. [press conference quote from subject about his previous experience] Before the match in Liège, Fernandez-Pardo only counted fifteen minutes in the top first division this season. In January he seemed to be aiming for a (temporary) departure from the Artevelde city. [quote] I suspect the others aren't much different.
Also it's very strange seeing a European team with a Native American chief as a mascot... JoelleJay (talk) 03:29, 16 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Draftify, potential for coverage in the near future, but too little currently available for GNG. JoelleJay (talk) 03:30, 16 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Keep (Improve). I wanted to say this obviously covers notability as per WikiProject Football Player Notability Guidelines only to see these got superseded, but still... while this new guideline setup will become a gamechanger, for this guy just look at some of the match reports of Sporza [5] Translated quote:
Man of the Match: Matias Fernandez-Pardo was best on the pitch by far. Since the striker got his chance, he has not let go. With two goals, an assist and some nice taps and actions definitely a player the Buffaloes will enjoy a lot in the future.
or [6] (1 goal, 1 big missed chance), or [7] Translated quote:
Man of the Match: Matias Fernandez-Pardo clearly put himself in the spotlights. In the first half with a painfully blatant miss, more than compensating this the second half with an assist and goal.

Made already too much of a name for himself to draftify. Pelotas^talk^|^contribs 20:53, 16 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

These are routine match reports, and the quoted passages are nowhere near SIGCOV. JoelleJay (talk) 23:21, 17 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.