- The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.
The result was keep. Hey man im josh (talk) 19:36, 23 May 2024 (UTC)[reply]
- Lynn Minmay (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – (View log | edits since nomination)
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Profile on an idol singer from the original Macross Saga, a.k.a. arc #1 of Robotech in the West. Recently prodded per WP:NPLOT and WP:NCHARACTER; taking it to AFD to see whether the rest of the participants agree with my decision to get it merged into/redirected to List of Macross characters or List of Robotech characters.
On a related note, stay tuned as I pitch a potential decade-old (and Waybacked) source that the page on the 1986 tie-in movie--a.k.a. Megazone 23's first go at U.S. licensing--could sure benefit from. Slgrandson (How's my egg-throwing coleslaw?) 17:51, 16 May 2024 (UTC)[reply]
- Comment - I have certainly never been a fan of Minmay, but describing her as "the antagonist" of Macross seems a bit harsh! In any case, I would say that List of Macross characters be the more appropriate Merge target, as that was the original version of the character, and this page is focused a lot more on the Macross version of the character, including her roles/influence in later Macross series. Though, that page would obviously have an appropriate redirect to List of Robotech characters to direct people to those versions of the characters as well. I took a quick look at the Japanese Wikipedia's article on the character, but it seems like most of the references being used there are primary, largely being official Macross publications/products. Rorshacma (talk) 15:57, 17 May 2024 (UTC)[reply]
- Minmei hate aside (which is purely tongue-in-cheek on my part), this is one good reason to maybe maintain an independent article: We have the same animated figure, with similar name, associated with two stories, both Macross and Robotech. How do we best represent that: at the character level o/r show level? No comment on primary sourcing--I haven't really done a search yet. Jclemens (talk) 17:17, 17 May 2024 (UTC)[reply]
- Weak keep. This is a classic and I'd think reasonably famous anime character. While I have not done an in-depth source query, Google Scholar returns 48 hits for the primary spelling. That said, the article is bad and I'll see if I can start a reception section or such. Ping User:Daranios (as I am a bit busy right now). Anyway, I am pretty sure this meets WP:GNG (if not in the current fancrufty form). --Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus| reply here 06:27, 18 May 2024 (UTC)[reply]
- Keep. The current version of the article strangely elides what seems to be Minmay's main attribute of real-world notability: she was, as this Kotaku article explains,
the first fictional singer to garner major real world success
, before characters more familiar in the present like Hatsune Miku. The 1984 release of the song "Do You Remember Love?" (the Macross theme song) featured the character Minmay as vocalist, and the release reached #7 on the Oricon music charts. This is covered in the linked Kotaku article. Additional attentive coverage of the character appears in chapter six of the anthology Media Convergence in Japan, edited by Patrick W. Galbraith and Jason G. Karlin and (published under a Creative Commons license by the academic collective Kinema Club). From a cursory look, a good deal of the GoogleScholar hits are similarly about Minmay's history as the first 'virtual/fictional idol'. Hydrangeans (she/her | talk | edits) 07:51, 18 May 2024 (UTC)[reply]
- Weak Keep per Hydrangeans - I somewhat suspected that, even if sources regarding the notability of the in-universe character might be weak, there would be some regarding the real-life popularity and influence of the music attributed to her. I am not entirely happy with the English sources as none of them are super long - there's quite a number of reliable sources that all talk about her notability as one of the earliest examples of a "virtual idol" that gained popularity in the real world, but don't say much more than that. But the sources available, combined with the issues regarding the best way to cover the character in other articles as mentioned by Jclemens above, make me lean towards keeping. I would guess there might be some good Japanese-language sources regarding the topic of the real-world notability of Minmay as well, but unfortunately, as I mentioned above, the Japanese Wikipedia article is currently all made up of in-universe information attributed largely to primary sources, so no luck using that as a resource for more non-English sourcing. Rorshacma (talk) 16:03, 18 May 2024 (UTC)[reply]
- Weak keep per Hydrangeans. The sources are borderline in terms of the coverage we need. I'm inferring that the amount of coverage in English implies that there's even more coverage in Japanese, even if the Japanese Wikipedia article is poorly sourced. I am convinced that WP:SIGCOV exists. Shooterwalker (talk) 16:01, 23 May 2024 (UTC)[reply]
- The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.