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I doubt Archie was his Christian name. Was it Archimedes, Archibald?? JFW | T@lk 22:06, 28 December 2005 (UTC)
He was named Alcibiades, but in tranlsation it came out Archivides. john 11:56, 30 December 2005 (UTC)
Confirmed at the detailed autobiography, posted by Archie Kalokerinos himself, at www.kythera-family.net - I was named after the hero Alcibiades. During the process of translation the spelling was mixed a little and officially my name is spelt "Archivides" Tearlach 15:33, 9 February 2006 (UTC)
Is ther emore than one adviser? Midgley 21:09, 28 January 2006 (UTC)
I can find no evidence that the Australian Medal of Merit exists. It is not part of the Australian Honours System. Can someone provide me with some additional verifiable information about it please. Maustrauser 14:01, 21 April 2006 (UTC)
Is there any independent source of the claim that he was named 'Greek Australian of the Century'? I can find no independent and verifiable statements that this is true. All the website references simply quote each other. Maustrauser 14:09, 21 April 2006 (UTC)
I can't find Archie's name in the list of awardees of The Australian Medal of Merit (but not all are listed). However, this medal is "awarded for rendering valuable assistance to the Legion in Australia. It can also be awarded to people not in the Legion but deemed worthy per the criteria." so the stated basis for the award seems unusual. If it's been mistakenly attributed to him then I would think he'd be embarrassed to see this. I suspect that this might be a garbled piece of publicityGleng 21:12, 22 April 2006 (UTC)
Starting to clean up and add detail - I know this is unbalanced but I'm looking for positive stuff to justify notability. Removed AMA citation pro tem pending verification - any reliable cite known? One dead link lost the other was very far from V RSGleng 19:36, 23 April 2006 (UTC)
OK I deleted this link and reverted the wording here because the link did not specifically address the q of scorvy in aboriginal children, it is not evidence that AK's views were discounted (maybe they were, but this is not a source for this). By all means debunk, but keep the V RS trail watertight.Gleng 15:48, 24 April 2006 (UTC)
OK, I'm worried about the content on this page; these are not facts they are reports of someon's report of what was said, in an arguably partisan site. I've read the AS articles, but I know enough examples of people being quoted by eminently respectable newspapers for things they most certainly didn't say to know that while the quotes may or may not be accurate, either get AK's words from a RS, or put the attributed words as quotes, i.e. "he was reported by X as saying Y" etc. We have to keep our house clean, let's be careful. If someone said that I'd said these things and I hadn't, I'd not be sanguineGleng 16:46, 24 April 2006 (UTC)
The version I replaced was misleading in that it implies he is right. The weight of medical opinion is that he is wrong. That's why I carefully phrased the Pauling comment and provided the link. Mccready 08:08, 25 April 2006 (UTC)
Whose simple "belief"?
Current medical opinion has yet to *show* or demonstrate anything about intravenous vitamin C and very little above (anything?) 8-10 g/day even orally for serious illness (vs mere cold & flu protocols that may run 8-24 g/hr orally, initially). AK, based on his clinical observations and trials, actually has experimental and clinical observations, although not a dbRCT. As far as I can tell, medical opinion has *nothing* but flimsy excuses. Moertel? Pauling nailed him correctly although it took over 5 yrs to surface some of the hidden bits. Whether AK is "correct" or not is wholly supposition, there are apparently no comparably high dose tests (30g-300g IV vitC/day, adults, 350-1000+mg/kg/day children) reported in the "accepted" literature (some wait with bated breath, almost 60 yrs and counting). 1g/day IM sodium ascorbate is the highest modern "accepted" value that I have noticed for even a secondary use. Whither 10 g, 30g, 100g, 200g /day IV vitamin C test data per Klenner's protocols or more recent vintages?
It is a simple fact that AK agrees with a number of "alternative" or orthomolecular doctors that have actually used IM / IV vit C clinically or run experiments of various types on various diseases. They agree, conventional medicine, with apparently ZERO experimental basis, doesn't. An apparent ex cathedra pronouncement. Klenner, *the* original vitamin C guy, pretty much said 30g IV vitC/day minimum for adults, regardless of size. Obviously no large scale, peer reviewed dbRCT - after Pauling's shabby treatment, including some older near dbRCT, who would waste serious personal money and breath on such firmly convinced medical opinion anyway? Interestingly, IV vitamin C would probably be the easiest to do a dbRCT with a multipoint design to boot, say factor of 3 to 4 fold multiples or with adjuvants.
The textual issue would be the observational & experimental agreement basis for *some* or which diseases for AK vs possible generalization to *many* diseases (I haven't picked through that much of AK).--69.178.41.55 21:01, 16 May 2006 (UTC)
Attempted to be precise on AK and vitamin C though am unsure in this as I don't have access to the original sources.
Huh? Then what on earth are you doing writing on this topic??
I just finished reading "Every Second Child" and its footnotes. It is easily available online.
I am shocked that your denunciation of this brilliant, sensitive, common-sense, life-saving physician, is the article standing on Wikipedia.
To point out just one of many areas where YOU ARE WRONG: he gave ordinary amounts of Vitamin C, eg 100 mg or less, NOT megadoses, to his indigenous patients (sometimes orally and sometimes by injection). Also, he DID conduct trials, and they all stunningly showed that those infants who were supplemented with these modest amounts, survived, and those who weren't, didn't. Tina Kimmel (talk) 08:17, 6 March 2022 (UTC)
Please correct my edits if anyone knows better from sources. I think it is the case that he was impressed by Pauling's theory, that he suspected that scurvy was widespread in the aboriginal children, that this led him to treat a large number of different conditions with vitamin C i.v., and that this seemed (to him) often to be very effective. Others apparently disagreed - but actually I haven't seen any specific critiques of his conduct or of his observations - obviously many have come to different conclusions based on other evidence, but is there anywhere a direct rebuttal of his particular evidence? i.e. - is there any refutation of the incidence of scurvy in the aboriginal population, or any denial of the benefits of his treatment of those patients? I'd rather avoid the word "claim" if possible, the difference between claiming something and stating something says more about the reporter's views than about what is said. Belief is also something to be careful about - is a conclusion based on direct experience a belief? I guess it is, but maybe it is simply neutral to state that these were conclusions that he drew, rather than beliefs that he held. I know next to nothing about this, as far as I can see he seems a humane, passionate and honest man who was probably (in my opinion) very mistaken in his conclusions, but let's be very careful to do him the decency of meticulously assuming his sincerity and rationality.Gleng 13:57, 17 May 2006 (UTC)
My problem is not with the principle of trying to explain how AK came to his conclusions, I'm all in favour of this. However I can't access any of his relevant papers - they're in PubMed by title only, the only things I've found of his that he's actually written aren't really germane. I have trawled the web - including john's sites, and there are a number of accounts of his views generally apparently repeated from each other, but none really describe his evidence. I'd be happy to help, but can't make bricks without straw. This isn't an issue of access to john's material - in this case I haven't found anything that really helps. I know what people say he said, but what he actually said and more importantly exactly why are hard to find. There's another problem with the article on Glenn Dettman - a potential embarrassment. He is credited with a BA and PhD from an apparently dubious institution, and with an AMA. I can't verify that he claimed these himself, so it is possible that these are just overenthusiastic misattributions by a third party, or simply that the institution is wrongly named, or that they are accurate and I just can't find verification. Again I've looked - just can't find anything to establish facts here. To be honest, I can't see that GD is notable independently of AK, and without any decent verifiable sources I'd favour deleting that article rather than leave it with potentially embarrassing bio mistakes. I'm not going to propose this, rather wait to see if some material accrues to it to clean it up- pace john, I'm not trying to suppress dissenting views, but looking for the means to represent their deeds and views accurately.Gleng 20:14, 18 May 2006 (UTC)
This article says that Kalokerinos is a Fellow of this organization. What is it? What does it do? When I went to its website today which is linked from the article, I found it was 'empty'. A google search picks up a mere 372 references to it, and the first reference is a Quackwatch one stating that it is rather questionable. What does it mean to be a Fellow of this organization? Do you pay to be a Fellow or is it an honour to be a member? Maustrauser 04:24, 13 January 2007 (UTC)
This article says that Kalokerinos is a Life Fellow of the Royal Society for the Promotion of Health. According to their website http:/www/rsph.org there is no such thing. Apparently anyone with a Bachelor's degree that they have had for more than five years and can pay the membership fee can become a fellow. So what is a Life Fellow? Maustrauser 04:31, 13 January 2007 (UTC)
This article says that Kalokerinos is a Fellow of the Australasian College of Biomedical Scientists. A Google search picks up 50 references to this organization. Once references to Kalokerinos is removed from the search results there are fewer than 40 references. This organization has no website. So what is a Fellow? What does it mean? What does this organization do? Is it important? It doesn't meet the notability criteria for WP, so why is it included as a qualification for Kalokerinos? Maustrauser 04:38, 13 January 2007 (UTC)
Why is this included as a qualification for Kalokerinos? It's like saying he is a member of the Australian Conservation Foundation, or the Balmain Beach Tennis Club. Anybody can be a member of the New York Academy of Sciences. All you have to do is pay the membership fee. How do we know his subscription hasn't expired? This is not a qualification. Maustrauser 04:59, 13 January 2007 (UTC)
This article says that Kalokerinos is a Fellow of The Hong Kong Medical Technology Association. This Association ceased existing in 2003 and became the Hong Kong Institute of Medical Laboratory Sciences Limited. According to its website it exists "to promote and advance the status and the common interests of medical laboratory technologists in Hong Kong." Further it only achieves 104 hits. What is the purpose of Kalokerinos' Fellowship? This seems like gilding the lily. Why is this a qualification? Maustrauser 04:51, 13 January 2007 (UTC)
This article makes much of Kalokerinos having material cited in PubMed. PubMed is a search engine for medical citations. It is not an endorsement. Why is it written as though being in PubMed is important? Maustrauser 05:02, 13 January 2007 (UTC)
This journal is widely cited in the article. It ceased publication in 1982. It has never been a peer-reviewed journal and thus is not evidence of the claims being made in article published in the journal being generally accepted by the medical profession. To be published in the Australasian Nurses Journal the editor needed to think that what was said was interesting, not that what was said was rigorous or correct. That's why peer review exists, to give some credibility to articles. I therefore have to question why every article that Kalokerinos ever wrote for this journal is listed? What is the list trying to prove? Give the man credibility? Maustrauser 05:15, 13 January 2007 (UTC)
By his own admission Kalokerinos experimented on aboriginal prisoners in the town lockup, injecting near fatal doses of ascorbic acid. I think this would be a notable inclusion for the article. Suggest a section called "controversy" to get a bit of balance back into this article. Benvenuto (talk) 05:05, 28 August 2013 (UTC)
This has already been answered, please see the comment above yours. --Daffydavid (talk) 18:36, 15 July 2015 (UTC)
I have just finished reading this book and I wasn't able to find this reference. I also did not see anything like doses of 240 grams being used. All references I see are to 100 or 200 _mg_ doses. (See chapters 10 and 19.) I notice there is no edition or page number associated with this quote. Until that is provided, I believe this quote should be removed. Feel free to return it, with a proper reference. DiagonalArg (talk) 11:41, 7 October 2015 (UTC)
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