The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was KEEP. Rlevse 02:34, 1 March 2007 (UTC)[reply]

One Be Lo[edit]

One Be Lo (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – (View log)

An underground rapper. Deep underground. So deep that the total sales of his top two selling records are less than 20,000 copies. Mostly self-published, too. An example of bootstrapping: label notable because it's run by this individual, who is notable because he was in a band, which is notable because it includes this individual. Guy (Help!) 23:23, 23 February 2007 (UTC)[reply]

• Keep It's beyond me why you want to delete all One Be Lo related articles. First of all, the sales figures are out of date (so they should really be updated, but that's another issue). Secondly, this guy is a hugely respected rapper in underground hip hop (by both fans and critics). All of his albums, both solo and as part of Binary Star, have had fantastic reviews from reputable sources. For instance, just checking his official Myspace page will show you he has had over 300,000 hits - massive for an underground rapper. Apologies if that was incoherant as I'm quite tired, but there's no reason the article should be deleted. Powelldinho 23:33, 23 February 2007 (UTC)[reply]
• Delete No evidence of third party sources. External links are his site, his record label and two Myspace pages. Show me the notability please. One Night In Hackney 23:39, 23 February 2007 (UTC)[reply]
  • Surely the album reviews on the S.O.N.O.G.R.A.M. page show notability? Powelldinho 23:43, 23 February 2007 (UTC)[reply]

• Comment Not in my opinion, I never use reviews as a measure of notability. Anyone can send a CD to a magazine or website and get a review published. Reviews of CD are generally not reliable sources that we can create an article from. One Night In Hackney 00:10, 24 February 2007 (UTC)[reply]
• Comment I disagree. If I were to start a band right now, release an LP with no promotion and sent it to the Onion or Vibe would I get a review published? Of course not, publications won't publish just any review, the subject has to be notable. That is why every single hip hop act doesn't get a review on rap reviews. With underground artists promotion is nearly impossible, artists in the undergound need these reviews. The reasons Guy are using to delete these articles is contradictory to the entire underground hip-hop movement, no artist will get high record sales or lots of media coverage when they are underground, this is part of the whole movement, not relying on high sales and controlling major labels for creative control. --HiphopisNOTdead 17:25, 23 February 2007 (UTC).[reply]

• Comment Well that's your opinion, but it still doesn't change the fact that at present there are no reliable sources for an article to be written from, so we shouldn't have an article. One Night In Hackney 00:27, 24 February 2007 (UTC)[reply]

• Keep The entry has value, he is a well respected artist. That may not equate into raw record sales but that is not always the best criterion to use when judging such things. 82.9.253.47 23:44, 23 February 2007 (UTC)[reply]
• Keep I agree, he is a very well respected artist in the hip hop community, and any fan of underground hip hop will assert this. His albums with Binary Star have gotten positive reviews from many reputable sources and the same goes as One Be Lo, his latest album S.O.N.O.G.R.A.M. has gotten positive reviews from many different sources including rapreviews.com and scratch magazine (see his website for these links). Also the fact that he is "deep underground" has nothing to do with this, there are many "deeper" artists who have pages, it seems that this admin here would like to delete every single underground hip hop article there is, if this keeps up there won't even be an underground section. Binary Star's page is already gone, don't let One Be Lo's disappear too. Third party links from reputable sources are as follows: http://www.rapreviews.com/archive/2001_01_masters.html , Review on Binary Star album Also on rapreviews.com note S.O.N.O.G.R.A.M.'s review (under One Be Lo) it states that the said album was released under Fat Beats Records, not Subterraneous Records. http://www.fatbeats.com/catalog/index.php?manufacturers_id=913&elvis=c6ba68a3a0eb40f90d7e5649c629fe07 This is One Be Lo's page at Fat Beats records, note other artists on this label. http://www.avclub.com/content/node/16006 review from the Onion (notable source eh?) once again note the label that this record is under. Is this enough? --hiphopisNOTdead 16:50, 23 February 2007 (UTC)[reply]
• Delete per lack of multiple, independent, reliable sources about the subject. ObiterDicta ( pleadings • errata • appeals ) 00:49, 24 February 2007 (UTC)[reply]
• Keep - I'm giving him the benefit of the doubt, not being particularly knowledgable about rap. He seems to be popular and has been interviewed a number of times by numerous websites. Also this and this and this. "One Be Lo" also gets a whopping 191000 google hits. Oh, and here's another review of one of his albums. Just needs those links slotted in appropriately, I guess-K@ngie^meep! 05:51, 24 February 2007 (UTC)[reply]
• Strong Keep To use the language of WP:MUSIC A review is a "non-trivial published work", and the above reviews all satisfy the guidelines therein. Low sales alone are not sufficient grounds to deny notability. Notability is a specific policy criterion on Wikipedia that is intended to insure NPOV and verifiability. This article is both neutral and verifiable from multiple reliable sources. Low sales impact neither of these two criteria. Richard Daly
• Keep There appear to be scads of independent reviews for this artist and his albums. The nominator should do his homework. -MrFizyx 06:42, 25 February 2007 (UTC)[reply]
• Comment If this concludes with the article NOT getting deleted, then surely Binary Star should be undeleted? Powelldinho 21:02, 25 February 2007 (UTC)[reply]

  I tend to agree. Binary Star (band) has an album on Wikipedia with an article. A notable member with an album article as well. It would mean the reasons for deleting the group were not correct. --RapPhenom 12:59, 26 February 2007 (UTC)[reply]

  I concur also. -- Richard Daly 20:43, 26 February 2007 (UTC)[reply]

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.