The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was keep. Consensus exists that coverage of the event is sufficiently notable that it should have an article. I have moved the article to cover the event. Xymmax ^{So let it be written} _{So let it be done} 19:37, 5 November 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Le Hoang Hung[edit]

Le Hoang Hung (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – (View log)

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Non-notable journalist murdered by his wife, fails WP:NOT#NEWSREPORTS. WWGB (talk) 12:57, 28 October 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This debate has been included in the list of Vietnam-related deletion discussions. —WWGB (talk) 13:06, 28 October 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This debate has been included in the list of News-related deletion discussions. WWGB (talk) 13:06, 28 October 2011 (UTC)[reply]

• Comment Looks borderline. North8000 (talk) 13:28, 28 October 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This debate has been included in the list of Crime-related deletion discussions. • Gene93k (talk) 14:30, 28 October 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This debate has been included in the list of Authors-related deletion discussions. • Gene93k (talk) 14:30, 28 October 2011 (UTC)[reply]

• Keep (Change to Keep and Move under Murder of Le Hoang Hung This entry is of interest to such Wikipedia Projects as Journalism, Vietnam and Crime, and while the case was in the news for a large period during 2011, including international news, interest in this case goes beyond recentism. While Le Hoang Hung was not murdered because of his reporting, which would have made him the first such Vietnamese journalist in 23 years, this case does tell us something interesting about the safety of journalists in Vietnam. The article gives background about other journalists, foreign and local, who have died while on assignment in Vietnam, which provides context. If a Vietnamese journalist were to be killed in the future, the Le Hoang Hung case would likely be brought up. It should be noted that Wikpedia at present tends to favor coverage of foreign journalists as opposed to local journalists, but the vast majority of journalists are local and they are also the ones who experience the majority of safety issues. Moreover, this is an unusual case surrounding press safety issues, which is another reason it should be a keeper. Here you have the police and NGOs believing the journalist was killed for his reporting and it turns out to be a sensational crime case. The CPJ is normally very conservative about labeling the motive in these cases as work related. Anybody who is interested in the press in Vietnam would want to know about this case. In addition, the article was the subject of a class project Fall 2011, and in the interest of full disclosure I am the instructor. Crtew (talk) 09:00, 29 October 2011 (UTC)[reply]

This was a simple case of mariticide of a non-notable reporter. His career and position as a journalist is completely irrelevant as his murder was totally unrelated to his occupation. WWGB (talk) 14:34, 29 October 2011 (UTC)[reply]

First, WWGB does not explain what he or she means by non-notable and shouldn't assume that this is self-explanatory. In fact, the article suggests the opposite. Hung's fellow reporters knew that he was doing important investigative reporting around the Ho Chi Mihn area, and secondly UNESCO explains that investigative reporters in Vietnam have actually pushed the envelope of criticism from within a communist, state-owned media system, which is a liberalization of sorts through the daily work of journalism. Second, even though he was murdered by his wife, the published photo of his burned bed raised concerns in Vietnam and abroad about what had happened to him and it focused the people from around the world on Vietnam press freedom and safety. Third, the case has a bizarre aspect to it that makes it memorable. Last, to be precise, the case wasn't matricide, but it is an interesting case of journalism and crime mixing in an atypical fashion.Crtew (talk) 02:49, 30 October 2011 (UTC)[reply]

My typo corrected (mariticide) and, to be quite clear, notability requires no explanation; it is a Wikipedia guideline (see WP:AUTHOR). WWGB (talk) 03:07, 30 October 2011 (UTC)[reply]

• Move to Murder of Le Hoang Hung, rewriting as necessary. While this looks like a classic case of BIO1E, the reaction to the 1E seems to be genuinely notable. PWilkinson (talk) 11:40, 30 October 2011 (UTC)[reply]

I would agree with this as it brings clarity to policy, the nature of the event, and precedent.Crtew (talk) 12:35, 30 October 2011 (UTC)[reply]

• Delete. A work-related murder of an investigative journalist turning out being an ordinary domestic dispute about gambling and money. Not noteworthy. - DonCalo (talk) 22:35, 30 October 2011 (UTC)[reply]
• Keep there appears enough impact in international press over a sustained period to address WP:GNG. One might argue the case against WP:BIO and so I would not be in a rush to move the article until there had been more improvement, in particular by trimming tangential material and then seeing if what was left still looked like a biography. --Fæ (talk) 14:24, 31 October 2011 (UTC)[reply]
• Even if the international response was misguided, it still happened. I'm inclined to say keep. DS (talk) 14:49, 31 October 2011 (UTC)[reply]
• Keep and Move to Murder of Le Hoang Hung. Even if the author himself may not meet notability criteria, his murder definitely does, based on the extent of both domestic and international media coverage and the involvement of Reporters Without Borders and the Committee to Protect Journalists. Although Le's murder is now believed to have had a different motive, it was still on the human rights radar for the better part of the year. --dragfyre_ʞןɐʇc 18:25, 3 November 2011 (UTC)[reply]

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.