The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was Delete, no evidence (in reliable, third party sources) of notability. Keeper | 76 | Disclaimer 17:15, 26 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Hi-Fly[edit]

Hi-Fly (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) (delete) – (View log)

Non-notable producer. Has worked with a couple of notable artists (claimed—nothing from a reliable source) but no hit tracks/albums, etc. Fails WP:MUSIC and WP:BIO. —Hello, Control ^{Hello, Tony} 13:36, 11 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]

• Note: This debate has been included in the list of Music-related deletion discussions. —Hello, Control ^{Hello, Tony} 13:39, 11 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]
• Keep: Hi-Fly is probably among top 10 most listened musicians on the Internet with only instrumentals and also among music producers. According to SoundClick he has over 5 million song plays. You have to remember that doesn't not include the final songs. Over 200 000 people visit his sites yearly. He has produced tracks for 1000s of small artists which makes him know as much as producing couple tracks for very known artists. Not that Hi-Fly hasn't, since his productions credits include artists like the grammy winner Bizzy Bone. As far as hit songs go, he did produce "Wybacz" by DKA which is a well-known song in Poland. The music video can be found on YouTube with 440 000 views. It's almost impossible to have a solid source for production credits because the source would be CD booklets and those aren't on the Internet. This unreliable source problem is common to almost all music producers in Wikipedia. Jingi (talk) 14:44, 13 April 2008 (UTC)— Jingi (talk • contribs) has made few or no other edits outside this topic. [reply]
  • Comment None of those stats (SoundClick/website visits/YouTube) count toward notability per WP:MUSIC. If you can turn up verifiable references from reliable sources that he had a chart hit in Poland then by all means add it to the article. That would likely pass WP:MUSIC. And if you can find anything verifiable+reliable that shows notable artists he worked with, that might help too. Everything I could find traces back to his own self-promotion or the Wikipedia article. —Hello, Control ^{Hello, Tony} 19:05, 14 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]

• Reply: Well, those stats suggest that he is clearly known throughout the world. There's YouTube and MySpace "celebrities" listed on WIkipedia so how could those not count? Hi-Fly is #1 on MySpace's Hip Hop chart in Finland. I can't really search the info of how "Wybacz" did on the charts since I don't know Polish. You can find the album on Polish Wikipedia at http://pl.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stawiam_sobie_pomnik but I don't know what it's saying. I do personally have some of the records he has production work on and that are listed on his production credits but I'm not really sure what should be the reliable source. Even Just Blaze's discography seems to have same kind of problems here in Wikipedia. You can find the records online but the productions credits are only inside the booklets, not on some Amazon.com info where they sell them for example. What I have found is an interview of Patriarch about his album "Son Of A Refugee" and he mentions Hi-Fly and also an interview of M-Eighty about his album where he mentions Hi-Fly. Both of these independent albums did very well but I'm not sure it's very relevant. I can get the links if needed though. The point of my previous message is that Hi-Fly is a bigger name than the artists or records he produces even though has has produced notable artists. Even Allhiphop.com asked him out about carrying Finland in his back hip hop wise. I've also read that Hi-Fly's future releases include Axl Smith's debut album. He is a huge star in Finland; the main host of MTV Finland. I simply don't see the point in deleting this article since he is known and doing bigger and bigger records. I understand that there's not too many sources but that's just how it is for most music producers. Media's interest is in the artists and not the producers who contribute even more. Jingi (talk) 07:04, 15 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Media's interest is in the artists and not the producers who contribute even more. This would suggest he isn't notable. --neonwhite user page talk 23:43, 20 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]

So you're suggesting all music producers should be deleted from Wikipedia? Come on. Jingi (talk) 10:37, 23 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]

• Not all music producers—just the ones who don't produce hits or garner media attention. To use your own example, check out the Google News archive results for Just Blaze. See all those articles? That is a notable producer. —Hello, Control ^{Hello, Tony} 10:44, 23 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]

That was not the point. He based his opinion on the sentence Media's interest is in the artists and not the producers who contribute even more. This is getting side track. On another note Hi-Fly is the kind of name that is really hard to Google. Jingi (talk) 10:57, 23 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]

I don't think that's what he was saying. And it's not too hard a name to Google if you add the word "producer": example —Hello, Control ^{Hello, Tony} 11:18, 23 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]

I was referring to these comments. I understand that there's not too many sources but that's just how it is for most music producers. Media's interest is in the artists and not the producers who contribute even more.. You seem to be defending this subject's notability by explaining exactly why it's not notable. If there aren't sources about a subject and there is no interest in it, then it's not really notable. --neonwhite user page talk 00:11, 26 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]

• Reply: I added couple sources to the article Jingi (talk) 10:52, 15 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]

• Note: This debate has been included in the list of Bands and musicians-related deletion discussions. —Hello, Control ^{Hello, Tony} 15:33, 17 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]

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Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion so that consensus may be reached.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Hersfold ^(t/a/c) 18:07, 20 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]

• Delete He has a few claims, but there aren't any reliable sources to back up those claims. Therefore, he fails WP:MUSIC. Ten Pound Hammer and his otters • ^{(Broken clamshells•Otter chirps)} 18:30, 20 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Right now I see 4 sources in the article. You don't see any? That's weird. If you think they aren't reliable take them off. Jingi (talk) 10:51, 23 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]

None of the sources show notability. The claims he's referring to are unsourced. —Hello, Control ^{Hello, Tony} 11:18, 23 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]

It's funny how you keep putting words into other people's mouths here. Jingi (talk) 11:46, 23 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]

• I just went trough a lot of hip hop record producers here in Wikipedia and almost 90% have one or no sources at all. Production credits have even far less sources than that. If this article is deleted, I think a lot of others should be too. Jingi (talk) 11:41, 23 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]

• Delete. Don't see how this meets WP:MUSIC or WP:BIO. WP:OTHERSTUFFEXISTS is not a reason to keep an article and if some of those need to be deleted, then they can also be nominated. Vegaswikian (talk) 00:12, 24 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]
• Keep. Of course it's known and reliable. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 83.9.245.72 (talk) 23:25, 7 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.