The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was delete‎. Sourcing is insufficient. If creator ultimately decides to accept draftspace, I'm happy to provide it. Star Mississippi 02:21, 6 May 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Alvaro Diaz (nobleman)[edit]

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No indication of notability. The only claim of significance is that he was Tenente of Siero, Asturias, and the only source cited (this) has no publisher, author or isbn, so is almost certainly not reliable by our standards. Alvaro Diaz is a common name, so searching for it yields many results. A search for "Alvaro Diaz" AND "Siero" gets:

no hits on JSTOR
16 hits on Scholar, of which one verifiably includes "Alvaro Diaz" (the pdf is not searchable, so I haven't confirmed whether it's the same person).
Gbooks gives a good number of hits apparently for this person; he was tenente of Siero, he bought a farm, he made a donation.

There's no in-depth coverage that I can see.

Note: he may also be called Alvar Díaz
Note 2: I've twice declined WP:A7 on this page. Justlettersandnumbers (talk) 09:59, 27 April 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Note: This discussion has been included in the deletion sorting lists for the following topics: Royalty and nobility and Spain. Justlettersandnumbers (talk) 09:59, 27 April 2023 (UTC)[reply]

I want to add to this discussion that I think he is notable because he is a Tenente which is equivalent to a governor of medieval Spain. Simply because he is a Tenente is enough cause for notability, add to that that he is part of a long lineage of a noble family and the point is strengthened.

The source which I cite has primary sources cited for every thing which it states along with numerous direct quotations from medieval charters and so it is a accurate and reliable source. I would cite the primary sources instead but I don't think its necessary and proposing to delete the article simply because the primary sources are not directly cited is not very productive.

Also the category of people of medieval Spain is extremely underrepresented in Wikipedia, furthermore the lack of secondary sources for this period is due to a failure by the scholarly community not from a lack of primary sources. Even so the number of secondary sources and primary sources should be sufficient to support this as reliable and notable.

If given enough time I will get around to citing the primary sources if it is absolutely necessary. --Tgec17 (talk) 21:27, 27 April 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Delete per TNT, since the creator objects to draftifying and the source is not RS. This figure might be notable, but I will not attempt to fix this page, since it would be the same as starting from scratch. Srnec (talk) 21:13, 28 April 2023 (UTC) — A source that may establish notability is this one. Srnec (talk) 02:18, 29 April 2023 (UTC)[reply]
Comment Wikipedia doesn't have an article about Tenentes, that page is a redirect to Lieutenant which doesn't describe the position as having a political or administrative role but as a middle-class rank in the armed forces of many nations. Then there is Lieutenant governor which is a deputy or the second-in-command in some Western countries like the U.S. and Canada but no mention of this office in Spain, medieval or at other times. And our article on Tenentism in Brazil describes "tenentes" as junior army officers. I understand it is likely that the meaning of the term has changed over time but using the resources of the project, there is no indication that a Tenente served as a governor or that this role, in itself qualifies a subject to meet Wikipedia's standards for automatic notability whether the officer came from a noble family or a common one. Notability is not inherited because your ancestors were important. Notability has to be verified by the sources included in the article. Liz ^{Read! Talk!} 22:11, 28 April 2023 (UTC)[reply]

@Liz: The office of a (medieval) tenente is a tenencia, which redirects to tenant-in-chief. The Spanish Wiki has articles at es:tenente and es:tenencia feudal. The modern Spanish word for lieutenant is es:teniente (from lugarteniente), "tenente" being Portuguese and Italian. The medieval term is synonymous with "fiefholder", but I thought a redirect to the etymologically related term made more sense, especially given that, like tenants-in-chief, tenentes held directly from the crown. Srnec (talk) 02:18, 29 April 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Delete. Even assuming everything is true, he is mentioned once or twice in primary sources in the historical record, dealing with trivia, which falls far short of what we require as significant coverage in reliable sources. Bearian (talk) 12:51, 5 May 2023 (UTC)[reply]

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.