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"He met Charlie Manson in Topanga Canyon in 1966" - Surely not. Manson was in prison until March 1967.
Should it be included? An edit summary suggests that this issue was discussed, but I don't see any discussion here. So discuss it here or link to where it was discussed please. DMacks 17:13, 2 January 2007 (UTC)
Do not call other user's edits vandalism unless they actually are vandalism. Because I was following policy and reverted the link to the blog appropriately the edits were not vandalism. If it is found that the edits were wrong then one must not immediately call vandalism, remember Hanlon's razor. Which authorities might you be asking? Philip Gronowski Contribs 21:40, 22 January 2007 (UTC)
Certainly seem good to me. Spawnopedia 21:44, 22 January 2007 (UTC)
Thank you Philip I won't. Spawnopedia 21:58, 22 January 2007 (UTC)
Image:Bobbybeausoleil.jpg is being used on this article. I notice the image page specifies that the image is being used under fair use but there is no explanation or rationale as to why its use in this Wikipedia article constitutes fair use. In addition to the boilerplate fair use template, you must also write out on the image description page a specific explanation or rationale for why using this image in each article is consistent with fair use.
Please go to the image description page and edit it to include a fair use rationale. Using one of the templates at Wikipedia:Fair use rationale guideline is an easy way to insure that your image is in compliance with Wikipedia policy, but remember that you must complete the template. Do not simply insert a blank template on an image page.
If there is other fair use media, consider checking that you have specified the fair use rationale on the other images used on this page. Note that any fair use images uploaded after 4 May, 2006, and lacking such an explanation will be deleted one week after they have been uploaded, as described on criteria for speedy deletion. If you have any questions please ask them at the Media copyright questions page. Thank you.
BetacommandBot 13:23, 26 October 2007 (UTC)
I've included more info on the Clair Obscur show, including references. Please discuss before removing - my edits on this were removed, saying the references were not valid.165.189.169.190 14:46, 30 October 2007 (UTC)
I don't know that actor is really accurate in terms of the primary, initial description of him - he didn't really act in much - there's not much to the "Acting Career" section. Also, the article states he was a member of The Grass Roots/Love and that's the primiary focus of the "Music Career" section. However, the founder of the group says he wasn't a member - he came around sometimes and hung out played rythym guitar, but was not a member. However, he has focused on music in his life in prison.
Would he even have a Wiki article if not for his involement with the Manson Family and his crimes as part of that group? 165.189.169.190 (talk) 14:43, 5 February 2009 (UTC)
Boby Beausoleil's filmography includes four titles, his discography eight albums. Surely that justifies describing him as an actor and musician? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 85.233.234.245 (talk) 23:50, 12 May 2015 (UTC)
At the bottom of the article, there is an external link to the "Home page of Bobby and Barbara Beausoleil". What is that? Did he marry in prison??? (if so, the Wikipedia entry makes no mention of this). Am I to believe that that is a photo of the Manson Family's Bobby Beausoleil??? What is this??? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 86.129.141.105 (talk) 16:17, 31 July 2009 (UTC)
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We seem to have a content dispute over whether Beausoleil should be identified in the infobox with "occupation = Multimedia artist, musician". As best I can tell, his occupation for the last 50 years is best described as "prisoner", and his primary notability is for being a murderer and associate of the "Manson family". I think it is not appropriate to identify an occupation in the infobox. —BarrelProof (talk) 19:56, 11 February 2019 (UTC)
About the ongoing dispute over Beausoleil being identified as Multimedia artist and musician:
All edits have been properly sourced and referenced after extensive research, with the intention of creating a complete profile of the subject, not merely focusing on the negative. No attempt is being made to leave any of the bad things out of reporting. Other significant attributes such as work in the creative arts both prior to and during incarceration are included. While I understand that some may have animus towards anyone who has been associated with Charles Manson, this cannot be the guiding principle in accurate and complete reporting. No person is entirely defined by the worst thing that they have done. His occupation for the last 50 years is not best described as prisoner. Beausoleil created during his incarceration, Lucifer Rising, which he is most known for and has gone on to release 9 albums, 4 compilations, and 5 singles. He has been creating art since the 80s with a gallery show in 2005 in California (at Clair Obscura) which is referenced on his page and one in 2015 at the Contemporary Art Tasmania in Australia
- http://bobbybeausoleil.com/newsroom-page-5.html
From 1994-2015, he has also taken part in various prison programs over the years where he was worked in video productions.
- https://bbreferencearchive.tumblr.com/post/162482353520/robert-beausoleil-resumé
Wikipedia promotes and supports balanced reporting. It should not be used to introduce a one-sided depiction of a subject. Mnpie1789 (talk) 20:13, 16 February 2019 (UTC)
It is clear to everyone that you have enmity towards Beausoleil on the basis of him having been an associate of Charles Manson and who committed a brutal murder. That is understandable and you are entitled to feel that way. However, your remarks reflect a blatant prejudice. Responsible editors on this page are creating a balanced presentation of the information. There has been no attempt to minimize the crime or to whitewash the subject in any way, but only to include other aspects of his life that are in fact valid and of interest, despite your evident prejudice against him.
Your attempts to remove these aspects of the history are vandalism. It is clear you are trying to "blackwash" the subject to make it conform to your personal orientation in regards to the subject. Truthful and honest valid reporting trumps that. Further attempts by you or any user will be reported to Wiki admin. Mnpie1789 (talk) 21:32, 28 February 2019 (UTC)
Again, the name of this page is BOBBY BEAUSOLEIL, the name that he has gone by his entire life since infancy, both personally and professionally. This should not be a matter of debate if you take into consideration that everyone who knows him or is familiar with his history knows him by this name. That's a pretty strong consensus. Again truth and accuracy trumps prejudice. If someone would like to start a new page called Robert Beausoleil, they are free to do so, but efforts will be sustained to preserve the integrity of this page.
There is no dispute that Beasoleil murdered a man, and that it was indeed a savage crime. He himself has admitted this on numerous occasions over a long period of time, but for more people than you would be willing to admit exist, Beausoleil is also a respected musician and artist with a modest following of fans around the world.
Please allow this balanced historical wiki to be preserved. If you want to start another page that only talks about the bad stuff, that is your prerogative. Mnpie1789 (talk) 21:32, 28 February 2019 (UTC)
Ghmyrtle The paragraph you altered is being reverted, and your username will be submitted to wiki admin for vandalism, along with this communication.
The paragraph you removed regarding details about the parole hearing was taken directly from the decision portion of the 2019 hearing transcript. This was sourced properly and indexed accordingly. Therefore, you are engaging in vandalism and in violation of the user terms of agreement for Wikipedia editors. The opening paragraph is being reverted as well, duplicating the form used on the wiki page for Bob Dylan: Known by name first, born name in parentheses. That is would be an issue to anyone is just silly, given that the title of the page is Bobby Beausoleil. Anyone can start their own page called Robert Kenneth Beausoleil, and if someone chooses to do so, this editor promises not to interfere.
It is evident that you have vindictive sentiments towards Beausoleil based on the crime he committed half a century ago. You are entitled to possess these sentiments, as you have good cause, but you are not entitled to use Wikipedia to express them. Wikipedia is an encyclopedia established for being a source for reliable, accurate, and comprehensive information. It is not a form for trolling, “blackwashing”, or a blog where expressing a narrow or biased point of view maybe acceptable.
Your assertion that Beausoleil is not qualified to having a professional history as a musician and artist is patently absurd. This assertion is obviously rooted in willful ignorance. All you have to do is click through the references already on the page to verify Beausoleil’s creative history. More references have been added in support of acknowledging the existence of the subject’s professional history.
It is well known that Beausoleil began playing music professionally at age 17, years before committing a crime. He was a member of the musician’s union for those years. His soundtrack for the Kenneth Anger film was reviewed by All Music, widely accepted as one foremost reliable sources of music information and was given a 4.5-star rating. Portions of that soundtrack have also been used in several other motion pictures by reputable filmmakers, including Gasper Noe and Chris Moukarbel, including a recent documentary about Lady Gaga.[1] In addition to this album, he has created and released 8 others, all currently in world distribution. This in addition to being very productive as a visual artist.
By the way, most of the information about Beausoleil’s work in the creative arts was added to the page by other contributors before this editor began contributing to it. Clearly, your opinion does not make a consensus. In any case what is important there is not consensus but accuracy and comprehensiveness in the information.Mnpie1789 (talk) 16:21, 4 March 2019 (UTC)
The edit-warring over the opening paragraph - seeking to describe him primarily as a musician, rather than as a murderer, contrary to the evident majority view of editors at all discussions so far - is, unfortunately, continuing. The only solution, it seems to me, is to seek to have Mnpie1789 blocked from this article as a disruptive editor. Ghmyrtle (talk) 07:59, 2 April 2019 (UTC)
Please be advised that there are some Wiki users who wish to use this BLP article as a "murderer profile" page, a strategy that flies in the face of a code Wikipedia policy: Balance and Neutral Point of View (NVOP), if that strategy deliberately excludes significant mitigating aspects of the subject's history. Believing that neutrality is paramount in an article reporting on a living person, this editor will vigorously resist attempts to introduce such bias that defaces this biographical article. Any responsible person who invests any time at all in researching the subject, Bobby Beausoleil, will find more than ample reliable information to support including, in addition to the criminal history, his decades of noteworthy professional achievements within the summary contained in the article. WP:BOLP says "Criticism and praise should be included if they can be sourced to reliable secondary sources, so long as the material is presented responsibly, conservatively, and in a disinterested tone...Bewared of claims that rely on guilt by association, and biased, malicious or overly promotional content. The idea expressed in meta:Eventualism-that every Wikipedia articles is a work in progress, and that it is therefore okay for an article to be temporarily unbalanced because it will eventually be brought into shape-does not apply to biographies. Given their potential impact on biography subjects' lives, biographies must be fair to their subjects at all times."
WP:NPOV "All articles must adhere to NPOV, fairly representing all majority and significant-minority viewpoints published by reliable sources..." This editor invites other Wikipedia editors to help in preserving the integrity and neutrality of this article, and to prevent it from becoming an expression of malicious intent through the exclusion or undue minimizing of significant and properly sourced information. Mnpie1789 (talk) 19:29, 2 April 2019 (UTC)
The title and subject of this page is Bobby Beausoleil therefore given name is noted secondarily (see Bob Dylan's wiki page). Also, I changed American murderer to American man due to BarrelProof and Ghmyrtle comments below from February.
":::Based on this small sampling, I changed your opening phrasing from "... is an American who is serving a life sentence ..." to "... is an American man who is serving a life sentence ..."
Mnpie1789 (talk) 20:30, 8 April 2019 (UTC)
I have several misgivings about the recent big edit by Griffdawg567. One is that it replaces the story of Hinman's murder with the "Straight Satan" story, as if that version of the events is unquestioned fact. In reality, my understanding that this is a story that was told only many years after the murder and comes primarily from Beausoleil himself. As far as I know, there was no mention of "Straight Satans" or the purported drug deal in the trial or in other contemporaneous reports – what was said at the time was about a rumor of Hinman inheriting money. The rumor of inheritance has been completely removed from the article by Griffdawg567. Rather than just give one description of the events and assume that is true, I prefer to describe multiple plausible versions and document the reliable sources where these versions of the facts came from. We should not necessarily believe what Beausoleil (and perhaps Manson) said a decade or more after the murder. There is a lot in that edit by Griffdawg567. Much of it seems to be sourced to a recent documentary film that I have not seen. I don't think we should assume that the content of that film is correct – especially if much of it came from Beausoleil and Manson. I corrected some aspects of that edit already, for reasons stated in edit summaries. That edit also added several references to the website cielodrive.com. It does not seem clear that the website cielodrive.com is a reliable source (although I have some respect for it). That edit may also have some other problems. I am very tempted to just revert that whole edit, because it has multiple problems and I think it is the responsibility of the person wanting to make changes to do so in a less wholesale fashion and justify what they are doing. The rest of us should not be required to clean up a mess made by someone else. —BarrelProof (talk) 04:33, 8 May 2019 (UTC)
The following section is not cited. It should be deleted or re-written in an objective manor, since this article is in reference to a living person.
Beausoleil went with Atkins and Brunner to Hinman's house, where Beausoleil had also briefly been living, demanding that he give them money, but Hinman told them he didn't have any money to give them. Beausoleil called Manson at Spahn Ranch and told him no money was forthcoming, and was instructed by Manson to hold Hinman captive at the residence and convince him to get the money before Manson arrived. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Qual479terrace (talk • contribs) 03:20, 26 May 2019 (UTC)
I wonder if it would be OK to include in the opening statement that Bobby is a music artist. He has collaborations with lady Gaga and several music albums that are on apple music, spotify etc. Other convicts also have information about their creative careers, such as Danny Masterson. Thoughts? GatosCiencia (talk) 16:12, 11 November 2023 (UTC) Comment moved here from previous location, where it was buried in an old/finished discussion; i'm neither endorsing nor criticising the suggestion, simply making it a bit more visible. Happy days, ~ LindsayHello 10:18, 12 November 2023 (UTC)
[t]he first sentence should introduce the topic, and tell the nonspecialist reader what or who the subject is...[d]o not overload the first sentence by describing everything notable about the subject, which i understand to mean that we should put the major reason the subject is notable in it, not a list of secondarily important things. In this case, there is no doubt that Beausoleil is notable almost entirely because of his involvement with Manson and murder; anything he's done since is very definitely secondary. Happy days, ~ LindsayHello 19:32, 12 November 2023 (UTC)